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darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: "GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus" 07-14-01, 15:46z  Well, life doesn't get any better. Further to my ramblings about NVIDIA end-June, my new GeForce 2 32MB card finally arrived (UPS must stand for Under Pressure Sometimes) and, having listened carefully to the best advice available from your goodselves in this forum and from some bloke in Compaq support with a funny name, I went through the complex process of insertion and installation. Yes, I killed the old card. Yes, I fixed the registry, I've got the latest drivers, etc. etc. But ........ ....to keep a long story short .... it's doing to my computer exactly what my previous nVidia card did, and I haven't even tried the TwinView config yet. Things freeze, randomly, but most importantly ..... without fail, FS2000 freezes on start-up or soon after. Now let's get one thing clear, Mr. nVidia ... the only reason I bought your goddamn card is for FS2000, since MS can't produce a flightsim that works fast enough for the average punter; and so I could live with anything else but this. Not being able to get my evening fix into Innsbruck or Bergen is driving me potty. Oh dear, what shall I do? Their CD help recommends mucking about with the BIOS but as usual talks in language only the people who wrote it could understand and anyway I can't get into my BIOS. Can anyone help, before I give up for ever and go fishing? I WANT TO GO FLYING! Any advice would be much appreciated. Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumont Top

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Subject      Author      Message Date     ID      RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus Ben Chiu 07-14-01 1    RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus darkmoment 07-14-01 2         RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus darkmoment 07-14-01 3              RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus Ben Chiu 07-14-01 4         RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus Ben Chiu 07-14-01 5         Reinstall vs Moving FS2K Ben Chiu 07-14-01 6              RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K darkmoment 07-15-01 7                   RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K Ben Chiu 07-15-01 8                        RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K darkmoment 07-16-01 9                             RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K Ben Chiu 07-17-01 10                                  RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems darkmoment 07-19-01 11                                       RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems Ben Chiu 07-19-01 12                                            RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems darkmoment 07-19-01 13                                                 RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems Ben Chiu 07-19-01 14                                                      RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems darkmoment 07-19-01 15                                                           RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems darkmoment 07-19-01 16                                                           RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems Ben Chiu 07-19-01 17                                                                RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems darkmoment 07-19-01 18                                                                     RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems Ben Chiu 07-19-01 19                                                                          RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems darkmoment 07-20-01 20                                                                               RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems Ben Chiu 07-20-01 21

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Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 1. "RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus" 07-14-01, 17:45z  ____________________ Mark: Sorry to hear about your troubles. First things first, have you tried installing DX8a? As far I can remember, you only had version 8.0. Next, you may want to double check the DX installation and see if debug mode for your sound and graphics card are disabled. I just read about a bug in DX8 and 8a that enables debug mode by default. What you need is a file named directx.cpl. If you don't have a DirectX icon inc control panels, you don't have this file. If you don't, here's a link for it. Drop it in your Windows/system folder, then open Control Panel. directx.cpl That's number one. If that checks out OK, or doesn't fix your problem, try completely uninstalling and reinstalling FS2K. There's a FAQ on how to do that here on the VPC. The link is http://www.flightadventures.com/faq/faq_fs.htm I'm sorry this is so much trouble, but we need to start with a known quantity and without fresh installs, we really don't know where you're starting from. Let us know how you make out and we'll take it from there. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 2. "RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus" 07-14-01, 20:56z  Thanks, Ben, once more. I previously installed what it says on the Microsoft site was DX 8.0a for Windows 98 but some of the references and drivers I find when I run DXDiag (a fatter version of your cpl file, for which thanks anyway) say 8.0, not 8.0a. The Microsoft site is not too clear on all this, so now I'm not sure what the heck I've got onboard. Can I install 7.0a over my existing DX? I suppose not. I'm inclined to say no way to reinstalling FS2000. My new video card is freezing other things sporadically like boot up (really helpful), AOL, Windows Explorer ... and FS runs fine under my onboard video (currently disabled). Can't believe it's FS2000's fault, therefore. This raises an interesting point. Neither in your FAQ, nor in any MS FAQ that I have found, does anyone cover the issue of how to transfer an existing FS2000 set up to a new computer - other than by serial cable, I suppose! In your reinstall FAQ (which sounds like it would take a week!), there is no reference about what to do with add-ons, tweaks, and so on. My problem is that I've so much in there, I can't remember what I've changed now, although I'm reasonably organised - scenery and planes would be no problem to sideline if necessary, but key textures in the root directory etc, and various module dll's ... oh dear. May I suggest some public posting somewhere about how to do the deed when it has to be done? With 7GB of FS stuff under FS2000, I certainly wouldn't just want to "delete the FS2000 folder" and start again as you suggest in your FAQ! No, mine stays for now ... if I can't get this flipping thing to work, then it's back to my old onboard graphics and the same old frame rates. I have to say I'm getting bored with all this; I can't believe how difficult it all is. And I build web sites so I know a bit about things ... what do dear old grannies do when their computer goes wrong? Buy a new one, I suppose. Mark Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 3. "RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus" 07-14-01, 20:58z  P.S. When I opened the DX editor using the file you gave me for control panel, there was no box for debug, just references to low and high settings for debug. Where is it? Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 4. "RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus" 07-14-01, 22:22z  ____________________ Hi Mark: What you want is the setting for debug set to low (far left). If your system is locking up on boot up you've got other problems somewhere else. (Fortunately, FS2K can stay for now. I was under the impression that you only had problems with FS2K.) Gosh, there are so many thingd to try I don't know where to start. The only things I can suggest is reinstalling Windows over your existing install. Sometimes files get corrupted/lost/deleted that reinstalling windows fixes them. Intermittent problms are the worst since you can't start to track them down unless you start swapping parts (after you've decided that your software is not to blame). I'm assuming that your system ran fine before you upgraded your video card to the TNT, correct? There is a way to remove previous versions of DX, but I don't know if there's one for DX8a yet. Stand by... Try: http://www.directxbuster.de/index_e.html Of course, make sure you have a good version of DirectX to install again on your system before running this (you won't be able to d/l a new version while removing the present one). The other thing you might try (which has been reported to work on some systems, is to try another PCI slot to run your video card in). Hope this helps. Ben Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 5. "RE: GeForce 2 MX400 TwinView Plus" 07-14-01, 22:25z  ____________________ Mark: Upon reading your message again, how did you disable your onboard graphics? This may be the problem. While you can run more than one PCI graphics cards at once, as we discussed once before, onboard graphics usually don't follow the specs completely. Ben Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 6. "Reinstall vs Moving FS2K" 07-14-01, 22:59z  ____________________ Greetings Mark: The issue regarding reinstalling FS2K vs. moving FS2K is one that comes up quite often, so I thought a seperate message would be better. Please understand that since I found out that you're having other troubles with your system and not just FS2K, a uninstall/reinstall wouldn't be appropriate... yet (there may be a problem there too, but we'll have to see once we sort out your other problems). The reason why I suggest a full uninstall and reinstall when tracking down problems is two fold: 1. It gives you a known base to work from software wise (e.g a clean install). 2. Many of the add ons that people try to save are, more times than not, the cause of the problems they're having. Although it's possible to copy an install from FS2K to a new computer, it's more of a hassle than reinstalling everything from scratch again. The reasons why it's so difficult to just copy an install to another system is FS2K makes registry entries. And if you have add ons, whether they make registry entries, dump dll's and other library files to other places on your system is anyone's guess. (IMHO, the biggest problem with add ons is there's no standard that everyone adheres to.) Anyway, as you can imagine, rather than trying to track down every registry entry and non-standard file placement (and its associated registry entry if any), then adjusting each of these entries to fit your new system, well, it's far easier (albeit the lesser of two evils) to just start from scratch. I hope this answers your question. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 7. "RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K" 07-15-01, 17:09z  All noted, Ben, and thanks again for your most impressive help suggestions. I've been offline all day with a black screen ...yes, more of the same ... but now I'm back in with a GeForce that hasn't frozen me up again yet but which has somehow killed my SYSTRAY. So my printer has disappeared, etc. etc. ... what a life. I have yet to try FS again, this is just to say thanks. I'll let you know if I haven't committed Hara Kiri by midnight. Mark P.S. Remember that "Lions in Africa" aircraft I posted. Barry Blaisdell has located it. It's a Let L-410 Turbolet, made in Czech Republic. Twin engined light transport designed for use on feeder ops and local service to include grass strips. Maiden flight 16 April 1969. Five variations, L-410A/F/M/UVP/UVP-E. More info at: http://www.let.cz/1410/3view.htm Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 8. "RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K" 07-15-01, 18:58z  ____________________ Mark: Sounds like you're making progress... sort of. You'll get it, just be systematic about it and you can't go wrong. Thanks for the answer to the aircraft question. I never would have gotten that one in a million years. Thanks again and please let us know if we can be of any help. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 9. "RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K" 07-16-01, 17:14z  It does appear ... similarly to the previous card, so maybe the same problem ... that when I turn down hardware acceleration to 25%, I can start FS2000. Of course, the snag is that then I get frame rates of 1.8 rather than the 3.6 I was trying to improve on with my factory-supplied onboard video, and pixels the size of small houses masquerading as clouds, given that I've lost my mipmapping and so on. So it's not the answer, but is it an indication that my memory is out of synch, maybe, or that there's some conflict that's not appearing in any of the Windows adjustment areas? eVGA say to fiddle about with the BIOS in their online help, but when I get into my BIOS (which I have found out how to do) the categories they suggest to change simply aren't there. Tomorrow, I may be tempted to find a Compaq Service Center to get this done. I'm terrified, however, of getting some spotty 18-year old "expert" who will politely tell me when I go to pick my machine up later that the only way he could resolve my problem was to reformat my hard disk or something. NOOOOOO! Mark Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 10. "RE: Reinstall vs Moving FS2K" 07-17-01, 11:29z  ____________________ >tell me when I go to pick my machine up later that the only way he could resolve my problem was to reformat my hard disk or something. NOOOOOO! Gee, Mark, we'll tell you to reformat your HD for free! Please let us know what they discover. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 11. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 08:04z  After trying everything in the book and more, eVGA finally concluded that it has to be a hardware conflict at the operating level and that one way or the other I have to remove all traces of the onboard video, despite Windows happily telling me it is disabled. That I should talk to Compaq again. So, once more shuffled around the help circuit, I did. They said today: "The reason for the problem with computer freezing after installing nVidia GeForce 2 MX400 32MB video card is due to imcompatibility of the video card with the system. I suggest that you contact the manufacturer of the video card to get compatible video card and install it in your system" This is a downer, to be sure, but I can't believe they're right. Does anyone, or anyone you know, have experience of fitting a GeForce in a bog-standard Compaq Presario running Pentium III with the Intel 810e chipset, please? My exchanges with eVGA are at: www.evga.com/community/messageboard/forum.asp?FORUM_ID=4&CAT_ID=1&Forum_Title=GeForce2+MX+Product+Family+Forum Aaarrggghhhh. Mark Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 12. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 12:04z  ____________________ Greetings Mark: A couple of messages back I asked how you disabled the onboard video, but you never answered. If you're unable to completely disable the onboard video, I would have to side with evga. As I mentioned in other messages, many onboard video designs follow the PCI spec correctly and take shortcuts (to boost performance), unfortunately this creates a problem with them trying to co-exist for additional video cards. I couldn't find anything about the GeForce, but here's something from someone with a Voodoo3: ===============================snip=================== Voodoo3 Video Card Doesn't Work The Voodoo3 video card has problems with the Compaq Presario computers with the onboard ATI video cards. This is due to the fact that the onboard ATI card can only be disabled within Windows. The Voodoo3 cards do not like any other graphics cards in the same machine (especially onboard ATI Rage cards). There are 2 ways that may get you round this problem, 1. If you go into the BIOS (F10 when the machine is starting up), sometimes you can disable the ATI card in there. 2. Try disabling the card through Windows, Click on Start/Settings/Control Panel/System/Device Manager. Click on the + sign next to Display Adapters and Double click on the ATI Video Card. Remove the Check mark in front of Original Configuration (Win 95) or Exist in all Hardware Profiles (Win 98). Close all applications and restart the computer. If neither of the above methods work, then there is no way of getting the Voodoo3 card to work. =============================snip==================== I also found some bad news about the Celleron 500 Presario here: http://groups.google.com/groups?q=%22Compaq%22+%22GeForce%22+%22disable%22&hl=en&safe=off&rnum=4&ic=1&selm=3a73e976.1602087%40news1.rdc1.ab.home.com Search Result 4 From: Hank Hill (abc@xyz.com) Subject: Re: GeForce for a Compaq Presario? Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.videocards.nvidia View complete thread (4 articles) Date: 2001-01-28 01:44:03 PST If your Compaq is similar to a Compaq Presario celeron 500, then you are out of luck and no video card will work. That machine with the intel 810 chipset cannot disable the on-board video. Compaq's simplified BIOS does not allow for disabling the on-board video. A voodoo2 would be the only option. On Sun, 28 Jan 2001 02:51:44 GMT, "Mark Duell" <fleacircus.org@mduell> wrote: >No PCI GeForces afaik, but the V5 5500 comes in PCI. > >Mark Duell > >"Don" <dont24@removethis.mediaone.net> wrote in message >news:89v67tkdq37fr7gaqslm1df6k14unpb6ea@4ax.com... >> What are my options for putting a video card in my friends Presario. >> No AGP slot. On board video. ( It's fine for 2d, but sucks for 3D >> gaming. ) It's a PIII 600. Any Geforce PCI cards out there. I thought >> about a Voodoo 3 3000, if I can find one. But I'd rather set him up >> with a GeForce. >> >> thanks ==============================snip=================== Mark, after reading that, I hate to say it, but you may have no choice but to dump the motherboard or live with the onboard graphics. You might try Compaq TS again for instructions on how to disable onboard graphics as one last attempt at salvaging it. Sorry for the bad news. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 13. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 13:38z  It's good of you to waste so much time on this, Ben! I disabled the onboard video using DEVICE MANAGER originally. That didn't work. I tried various combinations of disabling standard VGA, all things with 810e next to them, cut it out of the registry, etc. etc. Same non-event, same hangs. So then I tried all kinds of other things like: - removing rather than disabling onboard video within Windows (but of course it reinstalled); - going into the BIOS (your man above is right, it's a simple version and pretty well unchangeable - however it shows the GeForce as the primary card and the onboard as disabled); - using MSCONFIG to cut down START items; - DIRECT X testing facilities (all fine, both with 8.0a and 7.0a which I have now reinstalled); - using SYSTEM FILE CHECKER; - running DR. WATSON - running COMPAQ diagnostics, SCANDISK for the 100th time, disk defrag, blah blah blah ... ... and so on. Still hangs. I was desperate for a flight last night so I took the new card out for the third time and stuttered my way around St. Barthelemy with the original configuration .... but no hangs! I have spent some time with Compaq by phone today, and just to confuse matters, they tell me that the GeForce 2 is perfectly compatible with my system. Yes, you read that right. But I no longer believe they know what they're talking about. Too many variables. As you say, I may just have to reconcile myself to being stuck with what I have until I buy a new outfit with a fast, integrated system. Meanwhile, anyone want to buy a GeForce 2?! Thanks again for your help. I may try a Compaq Service Center tomorrow but I'm wary now that if Compaq themselves can't agree on this, then someone in Radio Shack isn't going to have a clue. Mark Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 14. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 14:26z  ____________________ Greetings Mark: No problem is too troublesome for us. We enjoy the challenge! (Needless to say yours has been very challenging!) Before you chuck it all, you might check with Compaq and see if they have a new bios version available for your system. *Sometimes* (at least with my ASUS for example) they come out with bios updates that add features. You could, of course, just pick up a new motherboard and move all of your components over. Then again, Compaq is notorious for making proprietary hardware, so you may need another case as well. Then again, both could be had for under $150 if you shop around. Sorry we couldn't be of more help. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 15. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 15:30z  Tell me just a little about what a new motherboard would do for me, Ben. I updated my BIOS the other day using the Compaq Softpaq system. I was very excited, as it mentioned updates to problems with "3rd party video cards". But we're not there yet ... That said, I reinstalled it again tonight and I'm writing this using it. No hangs for half an hour. Weird, eh? But I bet if I try to leap into my B1900 in a minute, there's going to be trouble ... I'm looking forward to writing in this forum about flight matters in the future! Mark Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 16. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 16:10z  My FS2000 crashed before my B1900 had a chance to ... ... I'm all done with this. So I'll just hang on for your motherboard (and memory?) comments before sending my nVidia back from whence it cameth. Mark Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 17. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 20:00z  ____________________ Greetings Mark: A new motherboard will get rid of the onboard video problem you have. (Well, if you get one without video onboard!). What you need to figure out is what kind of memory you have. Also, please remind us what CPU you have and additional cards (PCI or ISA and how many). I run an ASUS BX motherboard. A little long in the tooth perhaps, but very solid. I've had no problems with it and am currently running P3-800 in it. I'm sure the others have recommendations as well and will chime in when we find out more about your components. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 18. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 20:46z  My CPU is Pentium III 600 MHZ, with 128MB RAM of "Compaq memory" - no other definition found yet. Only additional PCI card is my HSP56 modem - that's on IRQ 11, whereas my graphics are on IRQ 3 (and sound on IRQ 5). Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 19. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-19-01, 21:47z  ____________________ OK, another issue just made itself known... you have an onboard soundcard. So you'll have to factor in the cost of one of those as well... If that doesn't make you want to throw in the towel yet, regarding the CPU and memory, you'll need to find out whether the P3-600 is a flip chip or slot 1, and what type of RAM you have (168pin DIMMs) and your motherboard's clock speed (100 or 133mhz). I assume your HD is an IDE. Most are these days, unless you have onboard SCSI. Ben Top

darkmoment Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 20. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-20-01, 09:18z  Ben! I hardly dare write these words for fear that the cursor will freeze in front of me once again ... but I think I've cracked it. And I know that many with the same problem haven't as .... .... I was reading deep into the Compaq Customer Community pages this morning in a final effort to find out whether any one else had commented on similar problems ... and after reading about nine hundred entries found a recommendation to install a Compaq BIOS update that, in Compaq's own listings, did not appear to apply to my computer - thus, I had not downloaded it previously despite visiting the relevant page several times. On further exploration IT DID APPLY and was said to (once again) address some third party video card install issues ... God knows what. Most at Compaq certainly don't, after the run-around I went through yesterday. The bottom line, however, is that I installed it anyway (nothing to lose at this point)and so far ... so far ... I've had no lock-ups since. I'm writing now with the nVidia card driving the bus and I'VE BEEN IN AND OUT OF FS2000 TWICE SUCCESSFULLY WITH NO HANGS. AND FLOWN! AND LANDED! As I say, so far so good .... I just hope I don't have to update this thread once more. For anyone who ever reads this who has any problem fitting a GeForce 2 MX400 PCI 32MB card to a three year old Compaq Presario with onboard video, the Compaq Softpaq BIOS update number is SP15675. Now I know why Robert the Bruce said "Try, try and try again". Perseverance seems to have paid off and Ben, my continuing patience for all this has been largely due to your unflagging and totally undeserved support. My next thread will be about flight issues. Promise! Mark "I'm up! Now where's the beer?" Top

Ben Chiu Certificates/Ratings/Crew Stations: 21. "RE: GeForce 2 and Compaq systems" 07-20-01, 11:13z  ____________________ FANTASTIC!!!!!!! Glad you might have it solved! Looking forward to hearing about any frame rate and/or video quality improvements. Ben Top

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